FX530 Intermittent No Signal and 3D Game Crash Problem

Discussion:

(too old to reply)

Ikaros

2009-10-10 17:20:30 UTC

I have a 2 1/4 year old FX530. My system specs are below. Sometimes
while playing the 3D game Unreal Tournament 3, the game will blank out
and I get a No Signal message on my LCD monitor. I have to turn the
computer off and back on to get video back. It is connected to my
video card via a digital signal cable. Also sometimes I get either a
BSOD or game freeze that I have to end via Task Manager. I've tried
various upgrades like replacing the memory and added a slot cooler for
the video card to lower temperature. I'm reading on the web I could
have a faulty video card or power supply? My computer only has this
problem running Unreal Engine 3 based games, which are stressful to a
system. All other 3D games play fine with no symptoms. What do you
think? Is it just caused by Unreal Tournament 3 based games or is
something wrong with my system. I thought it was relatively high end
when I bought it and it had the best video card out at the time.

System Specs:

Gateway FX530 - Windows Vista Ultimate 32-bit SP2, Intel Q6600 2.4ghz
Core 2 Quad CPU, 4gb (4x1gb) Patriot PDC22G5300LLK RAM, 500gb
(2x250gb) RAID-0 HD, Dual DVD/RW, Vantec ATA133 Rounded IDE Cable,
Delta 700w Power Supply, Nvidia 8800GTX 768mb GPU (Factory OC), Antec
VCool Slot VGA Cooler, Gateway 22" Widescreen LCD, Asus/ViXS
Combo-210E TV Tuner, Creative SoundBlaster X-FI Audio, Logitech X-230
Speaker System, Logitech Precision PC Gaming Headset, Logitech G15
Gaming Keyboard, Logitech MX518 Gaming Mouse, Rocketfish Gaming Mouse
Pad, Iomega Prestige 500gb USB HD, Line-6 TonePort GX, APC Back-UPS ES
BE550G

Steve

SC Tom

2009-10-11 11:40:07 UTC

Permalink

Post by Ikaros
I have a 2 1/4 year old FX530. My system specs are below. Sometimes
while playing the 3D game Unreal Tournament 3, the game will blank out
and I get a No Signal message on my LCD monitor. I have to turn the
computer off and back on to get video back. It is connected to my
video card via a digital signal cable. Also sometimes I get either a
BSOD or game freeze that I have to end via Task Manager. I've tried
various upgrades like replacing the memory and added a slot cooler for
the video card to lower temperature. I'm reading on the web I could
have a faulty video card or power supply? My computer only has this
problem running Unreal Engine 3 based games, which are stressful to a
system. All other 3D games play fine with no symptoms. What do you
think? Is it just caused by Unreal Tournament 3 based games or is
something wrong with my system. I thought it was relatively high end
when I bought it and it had the best video card out at the time.
Gateway FX530 - Windows Vista Ultimate 32-bit SP2, Intel Q6600 2.4ghz
Core 2 Quad CPU, 4gb (4x1gb) Patriot PDC22G5300LLK RAM, 500gb
(2x250gb) RAID-0 HD, Dual DVD/RW, Vantec ATA133 Rounded IDE Cable,
Delta 700w Power Supply, Nvidia 8800GTX 768mb GPU (Factory OC), Antec
VCool Slot VGA Cooler, Gateway 22" Widescreen LCD, Asus/ViXS
Combo-210E TV Tuner, Creative SoundBlaster X-FI Audio, Logitech X-230
Speaker System, Logitech Precision PC Gaming Headset, Logitech G15
Gaming Keyboard, Logitech MX518 Gaming Mouse, Rocketfish Gaming Mouse
Pad, Iomega Prestige 500gb USB HD, Line-6 TonePort GX, APC Back-UPS ES
BE550G
Steve

Clean the inside of the case really well, paying particular attention to
vents and fans. Check your CPU heatsink and fan for dust build-up. Pull your
video card and make sure there is no dust on its heatsink and fan (unless
it's an on-board GPU. Kinda hard to pull then). Make sure there is a clear
airflow path around the front and back of the case, and that it's not too
close to the wall. It definitely sounds more of an overheating problem than
a power supply one. And the fact that the GPU is OC'd means it's going to
run hotter than if it wasn't.

I had a similar problem running Bioshock on my 9600GT. I ended up pulling
the heatsink, cleaning all the old heatsink goop off it and the chips, and
using Arctic Silver. The 9600GT has the GPU and 9 other chips (probably RAM)
that the heatsink contacts and cools. After doing that, I've had no problems
at all with it.

SC Tom

Ikaros

2009-10-13 18:35:39 UTC

Permalink

Funny you mention Bioshock, which is another UT3 engine game. They
apparently load a heck of a stress test on a system!

I do regular dust cleaning and even added the rounded IDE cable
(replaced the flat ribbon cable) to improve air flow from front to
back, and my replacement Patriot memory has ribbed aluminum shields to
evenly dissipate heat from the modules, plus I added a slot cooler
located (the only place you can) underneath the 8800GTX which did
lower GPU temperature 10 degrees centigrade while playing Unreal
Tournament 3. I'll try pulling the 8800GTX next to clean any other
areas on the card that may be clogged with dust, plus you never know
if reseating it into the slot will fix any dust/connection issues too.

My only gripe is that the EVGA 8800GTX uses a special custom cooler
housing molded to fit next to the large CPU heat sink. Because the CPU
heat sink is basically in the way of the upper 8x faster GPU slot, it
makes it impossible to replace my GPU with an updated model which now
seem to have larger full length fan coolers installed :(

SC Tom

2009-10-14 01:06:12 UTC

Permalink

Post by Ikaros
Funny you mention Bioshock, which is another UT3 engine game. They
apparently load a heck of a stress test on a system!
I do regular dust cleaning and even added the rounded IDE cable
(replaced the flat ribbon cable) to improve air flow from front to
back, and my replacement Patriot memory has ribbed aluminum shields to
evenly dissipate heat from the modules, plus I added a slot cooler
located (the only place you can) underneath the 8800GTX which did
lower GPU temperature 10 degrees centigrade while playing Unreal
Tournament 3. I'll try pulling the 8800GTX next to clean any other
areas on the card that may be clogged with dust, plus you never know
if reseating it into the slot will fix any dust/connection issues too.
My only gripe is that the EVGA 8800GTX uses a special custom cooler
housing molded to fit next to the large CPU heat sink. Because the CPU
heat sink is basically in the way of the upper 8x faster GPU slot, it
makes it impossible to replace my GPU with an updated model which now
seem to have larger full length fan coolers installed :(

Is that the motherboard with the CPU at an angle? Maybe one of the shorter
8x cards might fit?

Hopefully cleaning out the one you have will take care of it. Does the slot
cooler pull air out, or does it blow fresh air onto the 8800?

SC Tom

Ikaros

2009-10-14 12:25:24 UTC

Permalink

Post by SC Tom

Is that the motherboard with the CPU at an angle? Maybe one of the shorter
8x cards might fit?
Hopefully cleaning out the one you have will take care of it. Does the slot
cooler pull air out, or does it blow fresh air onto the 8800?
SC Tom- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -

Well here is a picture of the inside of my Gateway FX530 computer:
Loading Image...

The blue Antec slot cooler pulls cool air in from the outside and is
blowing onto the bottom of the card circuit board. Technically it is
supposed to be positioned over the top of the GPU fan opening but
there is no way to do it in this case configurarion. But it does still
helps to lower the GPU temps by 10 degrees centigrade than without it.

You can see the silver CPU heat sink invades the GPU cooler housing,
so much so that EVGA must have partnered with Gateway to make then a
specially molded housing that includes a notched out area for it. The
EVGA part number is 768-P2-N833-BR (EVGA site photo -
http://www.evga.com/products/images/products/resizeImage.asp?PRODID=768-P2-N833-BR)
and even includes an EVGA/Gateway logo on the cooler.

This is why I'll probably never be able to replace the card with
something else unless I know the exact clearance dimensions first or
replace that block of a CPU heatsink!

Steve

Ikaros

2009-10-14 12:40:39 UTC

Permalink

Post by SC Tom

Is that the motherboard with the CPU at an angle? Maybe one of the shorter
8x cards might fit?
Hopefully cleaning out the one you have will take care of it. Does the slot
cooler pull air out, or does it blow fresh air onto the 8800?
SC Tom- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -

Well here is a picture of the inside of my Gateway FX530 computer:http://www.evga.com/community/ModsRigs/uploadImages/334302_10609_05.jpg
The blue Antec slot cooler pulls cool air in from the outside and is
blowing onto the bottom of the card circuit board. Technically it is
supposed to be positioned over the top of the GPU fan opening but
there is no way to do it in this case configurarion. But it does still
helps to lower the GPU temps by 10 degrees centigrade than without it.
You can see the silver CPU heat sink invades the GPU cooler housing,
so much so that EVGA must have partnered with Gateway to make then a
specially molded housing that includes a notched out area for it. The
EVGA part number is 768-P2-N833-BR (EVGA site photo -http://www.evga.com/products/images/products/resizeImage.asp?PRODID=7...)
and even includes an EVGA/Gateway logo on the cooler.
This is why I'll probably never be able to replace the card with
something else unless I know the exact clearance dimensions first or
replace that block of a CPU heatsink!
Steve- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -

SC Tom

2009-10-14 15:26:03 UTC

Permalink

Post by Ikaros

Post by SC Tom

Is that the motherboard with the CPU at an angle? Maybe one of the shorter
8x cards might fit?
Hopefully cleaning out the one you have will take care of it. Does the slot
cooler pull air out, or does it blow fresh air onto the 8800?
SC Tom- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -

Well here is a picture of the inside of my Gateway FX530
computer:http://www.evga.com/community/ModsRigs/uploadImages/334302_10609_05.jpg
The blue Antec slot cooler pulls cool air in from the outside and is
blowing onto the bottom of the card circuit board. Technically it is
supposed to be positioned over the top of the GPU fan opening but
there is no way to do it in this case configurarion. But it does still
helps to lower the GPU temps by 10 degrees centigrade than without it.
You can see the silver CPU heat sink invades the GPU cooler housing,
so much so that EVGA must have partnered with Gateway to make then a
specially molded housing that includes a notched out area for it. The
EVGA part number is 768-P2-N833-BR (EVGA site
photo -http://www.evga.com/products/images/products/resizeImage.asp?PRODID=7...)
and even includes an EVGA/Gateway logo on the cooler.
This is why I'll probably never be able to replace the card with
something else unless I know the exact clearance dimensions first or
replace that block of a CPU heatsink!
Steve- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -

Hmm, you mentioned shorter 8x cards. I just got an EVGA email about a
GeForce GT 220 which does look shorter than my current card and
especially those other newer cards that look like a long box! I'll try
to get the deminsions....
============

Look here: http://tinyurl.com/yllgtyf

The Palit brands look like they stop at the end of the back edge of the lock
tab. That should be short enough, you think?

SC Tom

Wettlesheim

2009-10-15 05:46:08 UTC

Permalink

<Snipped for clarity>

Well here is a picture of the inside of my Gateway FX530 computer:
http://www.evga.com/community/ModsRigs/uploadImages/334302_10609_05.jpg

The blue Antec slot cooler pulls cool air in from the outside and is
blowing onto the bottom of the card circuit board. Technically it is
supposed to be positioned over the top of the GPU fan opening but
there is no way to do it in this case configuration. But it does still
helps to lower the GPU temps by 10 degrees centigrade than without it.

You can see the silver CPU heat sink invades the GPU cooler housing,
so much so that EVGA must have partnered with Gateway to make then a
specially molded housing that includes a notched out area for it. The
EVGA part number is 768-P2-N833-BR (EVGA site photo -
http://www.evga.com/products/images/products/resizeImage.asp?PRODID=768-P2-N833-BR)
and even includes an EVGA/Gateway logo on the cooler.

This is why I'll probably never be able to replace the card with
something else unless I know the exact clearance dimensions first or
replace that block of a CPU heatsink!

Steve

I added this hdd cooler on my computer that I bought from my local computer
shop http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000HVHCKS I didn't attached my
hard drive to it. I came up with an idea to put it into an unused slot to
draw air into the front of the computer and the slot cooler in the rear
would draw air out.increasing air flow. Would it be possible to add a
exhaust fan on the side of your case to draw air out while a hdd cooler fans
and your slot cooler is pulling air in?
Good Luck,
Ron

Ben Myers

2009-10-14 13:28:49 UTC

Permalink

I've been following this thread, and now I'll chime in.

Graphics cards with nVidia GPUs have a long and storied history of
failing completely or giving flaky symptoms due to thermal problems, in
both desktop and laptop computers. I have replaced lots of them, when
possible. With some laptops, the GPU is integrated onto the
motherboard, so if it fails, you are screwed.

The power supply would be the only other likely villain in this piece,
but a Delta 700w should be way more than enough to support the hardware
configuration you've got.

Note also that your system has 4GB of memory, but the 32-bit version of
Windows can only address about 3GB of memory. This is a hardware
limitation of the 32-bit Intel CPU, and the same limitation exists for
32-bit Linux and 32-bit Apple OS X. I doubt that the extra memory is
having an effect on your system, except that it draws a little bit more
power.

I suspect that it would still be pretty expensive to replace the 8800GTX
card, but that is something to consider if you want to continue to play
Unreal Engine 3 badly enough... Ben Myers

Ikaros

2009-10-14 14:40:53 UTC

Permalink

Post by Ben Myers
I've been following this thread, and now I'll chime in.
Graphics cards with nVidia GPUs have a long and storied history of
failing completely or giving flaky symptoms due to thermal problems, in
both desktop and laptop computers. I have replaced lots of them, when
possible. With some laptops, the GPU is integrated onto the
motherboard, so if it fails, you are screwed.
The power supply would be the only other likely villain in this piece,
but a Delta 700w should be way more than enough to support the hardware
configuration you've got.
Note also that your system has 4GB of memory, but the 32-bit version of
Windows can only address about 3GB of memory. This is a hardware
limitation of the 32-bit Intel CPU, and the same limitation exists for
32-bit Linux and 32-bit Apple OS X. I doubt that the extra memory is
having an effect on your system, except that it draws a little bit more
power.
I suspect that it would still be pretty expensive to replace the 8800GTX
card, but that is something to consider if you want to continue to play
Unreal Engine 3 badly enough... Ben Myers- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -

Yeah I kind of goofed upgrading my 2gb (2x1gb Samsung/Kingston
modules) memory. I wanted to try gamer overclockable memory and went
with 2 kits of 2x1gb Patriot extreme performance memory with the
aluminum heat shields, which were on sale at NewEgg for 24.99 per 2gb
kit. They didn't have the 2x2gb version that seems to ne very elusive
to find. That may have helped my power usage at least with 2 modules
installed instead of 4 modules filling all the slots.

I was aware of that 32-bit limitation but mathematically it can
theoretically address up to 4gb of memory. But I think the system
hardware is grabbing the extra gb making you lose avaliable memory
from software and the OS. Either way even if I'm wrong here, 3gb is
better than 2gb and the online price was nice with free shipping too
so it wasn't a loss.

The memory like I said overclocks nicely from 667mhz to 800mhz giving
me a slight memory bandwidth boost. was sucks is that the BIOS is
locked so that memory is the only thing you can overclock. I can't get
to the FSB or CPU timing screens. I hear the Q6600 CPU overclocks
nicely too. What a shame.

At the moment I put the memory back to 667mhz defaults just to see if
the intermittent freezes in UT3 go away, and unfortunately they don't.
As far as the random no signal issue, it's like something in the UT3
game code accidentally triggers my 8800GTX to output an out of range
frequency from the digital port that the 22" LCD monitor can't handle
or something? Just for comparision, I ran the previous Unreal
Tournament 2004 version for 3 months after getting my FX530 (until UT3
was released in November 2007) and UT2004 never locked up my system
ever.

Steve

Ben Myers

2009-10-14 17:38:54 UTC

Permalink

Post by Ikaros

Yeah I kind of goofed upgrading my 2gb (2x1gb Samsung/Kingston
modules) memory. I wanted to try gamer overclockable memory and went
with 2 kits of 2x1gb Patriot extreme performance memory with the
aluminum heat shields, which were on sale at NewEgg for 24.99 per 2gb
kit. They didn't have the 2x2gb version that seems to ne very elusive
to find. That may have helped my power usage at least with 2 modules
installed instead of 4 modules filling all the slots.
I was aware of that 32-bit limitation but mathematically it can
theoretically address up to 4gb of memory. But I think the system
hardware is grabbing the extra gb making you lose avaliable memory
from software and the OS. Either way even if I'm wrong here, 3gb is
better than 2gb and the online price was nice with free shipping too
so it wasn't a loss.
The memory like I said overclocks nicely from 667mhz to 800mhz giving
me a slight memory bandwidth boost. was sucks is that the BIOS is
locked so that memory is the only thing you can overclock. I can't get
to the FSB or CPU timing screens. I hear the Q6600 CPU overclocks
nicely too. What a shame.
At the moment I put the memory back to 667mhz defaults just to see if
the intermittent freezes in UT3 go away, and unfortunately they don't.
As far as the random no signal issue, it's like something in the UT3
game code accidentally triggers my 8800GTX to output an out of range
frequency from the digital port that the 22" LCD monitor can't handle
or something? Just for comparision, I ran the previous Unreal
Tournament 2004 version for 3 months after getting my FX530 (until UT3
was released in November 2007) and UT2004 never locked up my system
ever.
Steve

The system hardware imposes itself over the memory space above 3GB. It
does not actually use the 1GB. Instead, a lot of the hardware elements
get mapped into high memory. And, to be accurate, depending on how this
mapping is done by the motherboard chipset and the peripheral devices,
more than 3GB may be available for use. I have seen the System icon
show 3.2GB or so on a 4GB system.

It also sounds like the real problem here is the game, not the hardware,
because the system runs fine with everything else. Maybe the game
manufacturer has an update? Maybe a different graphics card will not
crap out? At this point, any other possibilities are beyond my
imagination... Ben Myers

Ikaros

2009-10-14 18:25:44 UTC

Permalink

The system hardware imposes itself over the memory space above 3GB. It
does not actually use the 1GB. Instead, a lot of the hardware elements
get mapped into high memory. And, to be accurate, depending on how this
mapping is done by the motherboard chipset and the peripheral devices,
more than 3GB may be available for use. I have seen the System icon
show 3.2GB or so on a 4GB system.
It also sounds like the real problem here is the game, not the hardware,
because the system runs fine with everything else. Maybe the game
manufacturer has an update? Maybe a different graphics card will not
crap out? At this point, any other possibilities are beyond my
imagination... Ben Myers- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -

Thanks for the high memory explanation and other suggestions by those
replying to help me. I agree that the most likely culprit here is the
game itself. There are a lot of other players of UT3 engine based
games with similar lockups and freezes. Epic who makes the Unreal
series games has had many updates and patches but non address this
issue, which is a shame. They seem to point the blame at hardware,
Nvidia's drivers, or Vista, but all I know is all other games not
using their engine works fine with no ill effects. For example the
older 3D shooter game Doom 3 and it's expansion pack sequel have no
issues, although it uses OpenGL whereas UT3 uses DirectX to render
graphics.

Anyway, I need to just accept I'll always get random lockups with UT3
while I wait for the next non-UT3 based game out that grabs by
attention so I can move on and not question my hardware as faulty. At
least I got to upgrade my box with a few better components along the
way.

As far as when it's time to get another PC to replace this one in
another year or so; I think that I will build my own custom box
instead of getting an OEM restricted machine that have certain BIOS
features locked out and non-standard reverse case opening BTX
motherboard formats.

Thanks all,

Steve

Ben Myers

2009-10-14 23:14:35 UTC

Permalink

Post by Ikaros

Post by Ben Myers
The system hardware imposes itself over the memory space above 3GB. It
does not actually use the 1GB. Instead, a lot of the hardware elements
get mapped into high memory. And, to be accurate, depending on how this
mapping is done by the motherboard chipset and the peripheral devices,
more than 3GB may be available for use. I have seen the System icon
show 3.2GB or so on a 4GB system.
It also sounds like the real problem here is the game, not the hardware,
because the system runs fine with everything else. Maybe the game
manufacturer has an update? Maybe a different graphics card will not
crap out? At this point, any other possibilities are beyond my
imagination... Ben Myers- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -

Thanks for the high memory explanation and other suggestions by those
replying to help me. I agree that the most likely culprit here is the
game itself. There are a lot of other players of UT3 engine based
games with similar lockups and freezes. Epic who makes the Unreal
series games has had many updates and patches but non address this
issue, which is a shame. They seem to point the blame at hardware,
Nvidia's drivers, or Vista, but all I know is all other games not
using their engine works fine with no ill effects. For example the
older 3D shooter game Doom 3 and it's expansion pack sequel have no
issues, although it uses OpenGL whereas UT3 uses DirectX to render
graphics.
Anyway, I need to just accept I'll always get random lockups with UT3
while I wait for the next non-UT3 based game out that grabs by
attention so I can move on and not question my hardware as faulty. At
least I got to upgrade my box with a few better components along the
way.
As far as when it's time to get another PC to replace this one in
another year or so; I think that I will build my own custom box
instead of getting an OEM restricted machine that have certain BIOS
features locked out and non-standard reverse case opening BTX
motherboard formats.
Thanks all,
Steve

If and when you build your own computer, use an Asus motherboard. Their
boards still have reasonable quality and offer options for tweaking
performance.

Name brand computers will almost never offer tweaking options, because
they do not want the calls and emails to customer service when a naive
customer screws up a computer... Ben Myers

SC Tom

2009-10-15 00:35:36 UTC

Permalink

*** Reply in line

Post by Ben Myers

***
In all fairness, the 9600GT that I was having problems with is the only
nVidia-based card I've ever had a problem with, and I've been using them
since the ISA days. I had the same overheating problem with the dedicated
ATI video in my notebook, and used the same method to fix it that I used for
the nVidia, and now it works fine, too. I had a few other brands thrown in
there now and then, but the nVidia's have always been the most stable for
me. By far, the most troublesome and unstable were the old Diamond Stealth
cards. ATI cards were pretty stable, but were slower than comparable but
less expensive cards.
Of course, that's just my experience with them. Other's experiences may
vary.

SC Tom

Post by Ben Myers
The power supply would be the only other likely villain in this piece, but
a Delta 700w should be way more than enough to support the hardware
configuration you've got.
Note also that your system has 4GB of memory, but the 32-bit version of
Windows can only address about 3GB of memory. This is a hardware
limitation of the 32-bit Intel CPU, and the same limitation exists for
32-bit Linux and 32-bit Apple OS X. I doubt that the extra memory is
having an effect on your system, except that it draws a little bit more
power.
I suspect that it would still be pretty expensive to replace the 8800GTX
card, but that is something to consider if you want to continue to play
Unreal Engine 3 badly enough... Ben Myers

Ben Myers

2009-10-15 01:03:00 UTC

Permalink

Post by SC Tom
*** Reply in line

Post by Ben Myers

***
In all fairness, the 9600GT that I was having problems with is the only
nVidia-based card I've ever had a problem with, and I've been using them
since the ISA days. I had the same overheating problem with the
dedicated ATI video in my notebook, and used the same method to fix it
that I used for the nVidia, and now it works fine, too. I had a few
other brands thrown in there now and then, but the nVidia's have always
been the most stable for me. By far, the most troublesome and unstable
were the old Diamond Stealth cards. ATI cards were pretty stable, but
were slower than comparable but less expensive cards.
Of course, that's just my experience with them. Other's experiences may
vary.
SC Tom

Post by Ben Myers
The power supply would be the only other likely villain in this piece,
but a Delta 700w should be way more than enough to support the
hardware configuration you've got.
Note also that your system has 4GB of memory, but the 32-bit version
of Windows can only address about 3GB of memory. This is a hardware
limitation of the 32-bit Intel CPU, and the same limitation exists for
32-bit Linux and 32-bit Apple OS X. I doubt that the extra memory is
having an effect on your system, except that it draws a little bit
more power.
I suspect that it would still be pretty expensive to replace the
8800GTX card, but that is something to consider if you want to
continue to play Unreal Engine 3 badly enough... Ben Myers

Ya been lucky with nVidia. I see lots of them because I see lots of
computers. Though the failure rate of nVidia cards is low
percentagewise, IMHO their cards still present a significant risk.

Diamond pushed the envelope, running chips outside the specifications,
clocking memory faster thna rated speed and doing the same with
whichever GPU they were using. Unfortunately, I unwittingly contributed
to their motivation to push chips beyond spec by writing a glowing
review of one of their early cards for PC Magazine. I was much more
naive at the time, and did not have the hardware smarts to figure out
that their card was faster than the competition because they pushed the
spec. Back in the mid-90's, everyone was playing games with graphics
chips, cards, and benchmarks, because there were far more competitors
then, both chip makers and brand-names of cards. If a card was 0.0001%
faster than the competition, they made big news of it.

On the other hand, I have been running a Diamond AGP card in this system
for several years without incident. It's a very standard design with
ATI Radeon chip and 128MB... Ben Myers